Wednesday, February 9, 2011

Page 4 to cross check with files

One body Downstairs, four bodies upstairs by 8:30am, 7th August 1985..

Withholding the contents of the police message log from Bamber, his legal team and the jury, has proved to be the pivotal point in the entire case, since, it contained evidence that a female who had been presumed dead in the kitchen upon entry to the premises by the armed police, later died in the main bedroom upstairs at around 8:30am. This female could only have been either June Bamber or Sheila Caffell.

June Bamber can be excluded because of the blood trails found on the blankets of the bed and the carpet in the bedroom to the spot where her body ended up by the bedroom door. The lack of blood staining on the carpets outside the main bedroom, i.e. on the landing outside and the main stairs and the hallway leading to and from the kitchen downstairs, informs us that June was not the female who had been found in the kitchen. We are therefore left with the fact that the only female it could have been was Sheila.

Now, according to the official version of events, Sheila's body was found laid out alongside the bed in the main bedroom with the family owned rifle on top of her. It was the prosecutions case at trial that she had been shot twice and killed there in the place where her body was found, but blood staining found upon her nightdress and the carpet outside her own bedroom door and close to the landing outside the main bedroom door where the body of June Bamber was found, suggests that she had been shot at least once before she ended up in the main bedroom with the rifle on top of her and more crucially with a second fatal shot under the chin.

I do not think there is now any doubt whatsoever, that Sheila's body was stage managed inside the main bedroom after the second shot had been fired. Such are the fundamental clues which leap out of the crime scene photographs which were taken by PC Bird from 10 O'clock onwards, that morning, that one is left puzzled as to why and how the police at the scene could have mistaken such clues as being supportive of her taking her own life?

Anyone who has the misfortune to see the pictures which PC Bird took of Sheila's body in the bedroom, will realize that if Sheila's body was found by the police as shown in the photographs that there is no way anybody could come to the conclusion that she had killed herself. Yet, for some inexplicable reason, this is precisely what Essex police did.

Essex police concluded that Sheila Caffell had taken her own life in the main bedroom by shooting herself with the family owned .22 anshuzt rifle. They concluded that she had shot herself twice by a process of recoil, where the second shot had been discharged within a split second of the first shot and that this was the correct interpretation for why she had two wounds upon her neck / throat. But anyone who has seen the crime scene photographs of her body with the rifle so perfectly laid down the center of her body and her right hand upon it, will inevitably conclude that she could not have shot herself twice as described by the police and end up on the bedroom floor so perfectly aligned with the edge of the bed.

Moreover..

So perfectly laid out was Sheila Caffells body that her head was placed to one side of a bedside cabinet next to the bed which made its position out of alignment to have allowed the fatal bullet (PV/19) under the chin to penetrate her mouth and enter into her brain, from where the pathologist, Peter Venezis, later recovered it. There are so many other clues which clearly point to the fact that if Sheila's body had been found like that shown in the crime scene photographs, that the only conclusion which could reasonably have been drawn was that she had been killed by another and or that her body had been stage managed before PC Bird took his photographs from 10 O'clock that morning.

The fact that Sheila's body has been stage managed in time for PC Bird (SOC) to photograph it from 10 O'clock, onwards, does not necessarily mean that she was murdered by anyone, unless this was the exact position that the raid team did find her body when they entered the house. In those circumstances, I would have to say that she was murdered and her body was stage managed by the killer. But, if her body was originally found in the kitchen, presumed dead by members of the raid team, and Sheila regained consciousness and fled upstairs by use of a small stairway in the corner of the kitchen, which led up to the landing outside the bedroom doors, and she entered the main bedroom at that time, and took possession of a rifle which had been found leaning against the bedroom window, and she had shot herself by use of it at around 8:30am, it remains possible that that part of the police operation inside the premises where her body had been incorrectly presumed to have been dead in the kitchen, was covered up and that officers simply agreed to write up their reports as though Sheila's body had always been inside the main bedroom and it had never been in the kitchen at all.

If Sheila's body had been in the kitchen (as contended by the contents of the recently disclosed police message logs) one thing is absolutely certain, and that is that Jeremy Bamber could not have killed her in the main bedroom upstairs, and he could not have stage managed her body there. If her body was stage managed, in these circumstances it could only have been done by police officers inside the house who covered up what really took place. Afterall, Sheila Caffell need not have died if her body had been properly examined when the raid team came upon it in the kitchen at 7:37am. The negligent manner with which the police operation had been conducted inside the house ultimately led to Sheila Caffells death, upstairs in the main bedroom. It was a very serious situation and it had very serious consequences for the victim and the police themselves.

WPC Jeapes was a trained firearms instructor who attended the incident and at about 7:15am, some 15 minutes before the raid team began its approach to smash the door of the premises in, she saw a rifle leaning up against the bedroom window. It was this rifle which Sheila took possession of and which she shot herself with after the police had already searched the entire premises and declared the building safe and secure with five bodies inside, two downstairs and three upstairs. Failure by the raid team to seize and make the rifle at the bedroom window, safe, contributed to Sheila Caffells death in the main bedroom.

It was these matters which the police at the scene covered up and why Sheila's body was stage managed and laid out at the side of the bed with the rifle on top of her body and why the police concluded that she had taken her own life despite the fact the the positioning of her body and the gun upon it, indicated that she could not possibly have committed suicide and end up on the bedroom floor like that.

The two different explanations about where the bodies had been found help to explain the cover up which the police inside the house and at the scene undertook. The police operation started off with two bodies downstairs and three bodies upstairs (by (8:10am) and finished or ended up with only one body downstiars and four bodies upstairs by 8:30am.

Members of the raid team who went into the house did not testify at Bambers court as to where they found the five bodies and the contents of the police message log were deliberately withheld and concealed from Bamber, his legal team and the jury which tried him. If the police who entered the house had testified and the contents of the police message log had been disclosed, Bambers legal team would have been able to argue that Sheila was still very much alive inside the house after the police entered it at 7:30am. Moreover, they would have been able to argue that the second fatal shot had been inflicted after 7:30am, and in those circumstances, Bamber could not possibly have been responsible for her death upstairs in the main bedroom.
Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-06-2008 at 01:44 AM.


  • #122

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    [QUOTE=Bluefox;9121821]You sound different from your first postings, as if another person were posting

    Mike. You are posting on at least 3 sites, one of which appears to be your own, you know the one i refer to, S L I, and numerous references to the Bamber case by yourself come up on the internet.

    You post in the name of Mike Tesko, and yet refer to him in the third person! Are you that Mike Tesko, who was charged with some counts of burglary and two assaults against police, and the corruption by police of which you spoke?

    This would account for the fact that you may have spent time sharing a cell with Bamber. (But would a mere burglar be placed in the same cell as a convicted killer) i don't know. You see, i asked if you were actually a lawyer, but you declined to answer! Therefore, it's open to speculation. I have to then ask myself, why would you spend what seems to be any spare time you have. almost obssessively posting about Bamber's innocence.

    I'm not saying he's guilty, i'm not saying he's innocent. I feel the judge at the time hadn't any right to say, 'the killer could only have been Sheila, or Jeremy. But in the extensive research and reading i've done, i have to agree with him. In all honesty, if the case were tried today, with all evidence submitted, i feel that the conviction would have been declared 'UNSAFE'[/QUOTE
    ------------------------
    Bluefox:-

    I have never tried to hide my past, it is an integral part of what makes me who I am. Unless you have ever been the victim of police corruption you will never understand the effect such exposure has upon a person. I do not hold that against you or anybody else, for that matter, but as a victim of police corruption in the circumstances of my own case, it HAS allowed me to examine other cases from the same sort of general era to see if similar tactics were used or adopted in these other prosecutions. I must admit that in the vast majority of cases, police investigations are carried out in an exemplary fashion but every now and then comes along a case where the rule book is thrown out of the window.

    During the 1970's and up to and including the late 1980's, the crime squads up and down the length and breath of the UK developed a bad reputation for falsifying evidence that was to be used to prosecute certain types of individual. Suspected terrorists, bank robbers, burglars and murderers, all fell foul to such practices and the courts turned their faces away from what was taking place. The case of Jeremy Bamber is one of these cases.

    However, it would be true to say that it was never the intention of Essex police to implicate Jeremy Bamber in these killings, in fact, they went out of their way to keep him out of the picture during the first month of the investigation. Essex police were only interested in keeping the cover up under wraps and they almost got away with it had not the relatives not got suspicious of what the police had been telling them?

    By the time ACC Peter Simpson got around to ordering a fresh investigation into the killings (6th September 1985) the bodies of the three adult victims had already been disposed of by way of cremation and the police had already informed the Coroners court of the circumstances surrounding Sheila Caffells death and how she had killed the others before taking her own life with the family owned rifle in the main bedroom. By the time the investigation changed, a lot of water had already passed under the bridge and the police who were involved in the cover up were put in a catch 22 situation:-

    (1) was it time to own up and admit the truth about what had really taken place?

    (2) Did they let the new investigation take its natural course?

    The officers involved in the cover up, decided on option (2). It was one thing to admit that the police operation inside the house had gone dramatically wrong which had led to the loss of life in Sheila Caffells case, and to have to admit to failing to seize the rifle at the bedroom window and to make it safe so as to prevent Sheila taking possession of it and using it upon herself in the main bedroom, but the police went even further and lied to the Corner about the circumstances of Sheila's death, which caused him to authorize the release of the bodies for disposal. All these things had happened and taken place before the nature of the investigation changed. From my point of view, it was at this stage that the police who were involved in the cover up to try and save their own skins, went along with allowing a false case to be built up to prosecute Bamber for these murders.

    Some of the officers involved in the second part of the police investigation (from 6th September 1985, onwards) were not privy to the fact that the police operation inside whf had gone dramatically wrong or that Sheila's body was originally found in the kitchen.

    For the record, I have never shared a cell with Jeremy Bamber, I was merely in the same maximum security prison as he was, on the same wing, in the cell next door to him. Although, I did spend Christmas dinner (December 1989) in his cell with him for a period of about four hours. In the main I spoke to Jeremy a lot about his case whenever we had the opportunity, both during the day when we were studying on university courses and evening in our recreation time.

    I have never refused to answer any questions about being a lawyer, fact is I am not and never have been one.


  • #123

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Raid Team had every reason to lie..

    Fact of the matter is..

    We now know that there was a huge fall out between Police Sergeant Adams and Police inspector Montgomery, of the firearms unit. PS Adams was not very happy that midway through the police operation at the scene, that Montgomery took control of the operation inside the house, against force policy rules.

    PS Adams was the first senior firearms officer to arrive at the scene and force policy dictated that he was to be the commander of the police operation to surround, contain and enter the premises. At 7:30am, when the six members of the raid party were dispatched towards the house to force the external door, PS Adams assumed command and did so right up until 8:10am, when the last message was passed from inside the farmhouse to the effect that the building had been thoroughly searched and the premises were now safe and secure for senior officers to enter.

    DCI Harris and Police Inspector Montgomery then entered the house after this message was passed.

    Both were not prepared for what they stumbled upon after they both entered the kitchen - the female body which had been found there when the six members of the raid team had first got into the premises was no longer there..

    DCI Harris spoke to ACC Peter Simpson by use of the kitchen phone.

    Police Inspector Montgomery assumed control of the police operation from inside the house as a result of the dramatic developments after 8:10am.

    This is one of the very rare occasions when command for such an operation has ever changed hands midst an operation which was still on going.

    Adams and Montgomery exchanged harsh words at the debriefing which took place later that same evening ..

    Adams pointed out that the body of Sheila Caffell which was being shown to have a rifle on top of her body when PC Bird took his photographs at around 10 O'clock, had not had any weapon upon it when he had visited the scene in the main bedroom at around 9am, that same morning, and her body according to Adams had been away from the edge of the bed. Also a bible which was shown to be resting partially upon the victims upper and outer right arm, had been somewhere else on the bedroom carpet when Adams had viewed the body..

    Everything Adams was saying at the debrief, is consistent with the police inside the house stage managing Sheila Caffells body after 9 am, when PS Adams had left the scene. Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell did not get to hear about what PS Adams had been saying at the debrief which took place on the evening of 7th August 1985. Had he done so, I have no doubt in my mind that the good professor would have concluded that the police had been responsible for disturbing and stage managing the victims body before PC Bird took photographs of it..

    The fact that the police inside the building had stage managed Sheila's body and that they had arrived at the conclusion that she had taken her own life, despite the existence of very strong evidence to the contrary, gives a clear insight into the reasoning behind why the police inside the house covered up the part of the operation which had gione wrong from 8:10am, onwards that morning..


  • #124

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Bell View Post
    Mike, you are all over the place. You spent most of the 1st 2 pages of this thread accusing the Essex police of staging a conspiracy and now you post this:However, it would be true to say that it was never the intention of Essex police to implicate Jeremy Bamber in these killings But in your next post you state the very opposite.
    ---------
    Joseph Bell:-

    There were two parts to this investigation, the first part which ran between 7th August 1985 and the 6th September 1985, under the crime reference SC/688/85, and the second part of the investigation (under the crime reference SC/786/85) which ran from 6th September 1985, onwards.

    For the purpose of being specific and so there can be no further misunderstanding on your part, it is my case that the police who put together the original file (SC/688/85) did not set out to falsify a case to implicate Jeremy Bamber in these murders, but that the second group of officers who put together the second part of the investigation (SC/786/85) did.

    Information contained in the fist file (SC/688/85) was edited and in most instances disposed of altogether, and was NOT carried over into the new file (SC/786/85) something which caused the City of London police a great deal of concern during their investigation into the handling of this case in the early 1990's., since they could not locate the original file (SC/688/85) which existed for the first month of the investigation back in 1985.

    You can choose to make of that what you will, but for my part I am satisfied that the disposal of the original file (SC/688/85) which contained all the information and evidence to prove that Sheila killed the others and then herself, is a significant feature which suggests that there was some sort of a cover up surrounding what took place at the scene when the police first got into the house. For some reason, the new investigation (SC/786/85) chose to ignore or to turn a blind eye to the existence of the police message log contents which places two dead bodies downstairs in the kitchen from as early as 7:37am, and only three other bodies upstairs by 8:10am. Instead the new investigation (SC/786/85) chose to promote the false idea that only one dead body was found downstairs in the kitchen and that the other four bodies had been found upstairs?

    Two different versions of where the police found the bodies of the five victims upon entry into the premises does not sit well with the suggestion that the police are telling the truth, since, there could not be two bodies downstairs in the kitchen and three bodies upstairs at the same time that there was only one body downstairs in the kitchen, and four bodies upstairs..

    The question everyone has to ask themselves about this case, is why the police only chose to disclose the version which placed one body downstairs, and four other bodies upstairs - why conceal for over 23 years, the existence of the police message log contents, which confirm that the police found two bodies in the kitchen, and three other bodies upstairs?

    The deliberate withholding of the police message log contents and the information they contain would have been capable of establishing in the minds of the jury that Bamber could not have killed his sister in the main bedroom and that he had not stage managed her body there as alleged by the prosecution, because the police had originally found her body downstairs in the kitchen.

    For all these reasons and more, the police officers who put together the second part of the investigation (SC/786/85) into these deaths, set out to Frame Jeremy Bamber for these awful murders despite evidence existing in their possession that contradicted such a view or proposal.

    This would be my explanation in response to your attempt to ridicule what I have been trying to say.


  • #125

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Bell View Post
    Mike, just post what you promised.
    -----------------------------
    Joseph Bell:-

    Yes, I am sorry for the delay, but you have been waiting only for a few weeks for the information I have to be disclosed, imagine how Jeremy Bamber and his legal team have been feeling having to wait over 23 years for similar information which Essex police have deliberately withheld and concealed from him, and them and of course from the court which tried him.

    I will post the material very soon..

    Thanks for being patient..


  • #126

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Bell View Post
    Mike, I haven't been waiting for 'a few weeks' . I've been waiting for quite a while. I don't know where I have tried to 'ridicule' you.

    I'm still on the jury. Give me what Bamber's jury didn't get. From the beginning and I'll repeat it again now. I don't have a vested interest in whether Bamber stays in prison or is set free. It is not going to change my life one iota.

    Give me the Dr's reports. I'm a reasonable person. If the evidence from a credible, unbiased source says that Bamber didn't do it then Bamber didn't do it.

    Don't keep posting the same stuff over and over. It's not helping.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Joseph Bell:-

    I have taken your points on board, I do not want you to think or believe that I am in some way unreasonable. I am interested in your suggestion that you want me to give you access to the evidence and the information which Bambers jury did not get..

    There is a lot of it..

    At the moment, for example, there are over 3 million pieces of undisclosed evidence which Essex police and the CPS are withholding under Public Interest Immunity (pii rules), which even as we speak, Jeremy Bamber and his legal advisor's, and the jury which tried him, did not get access to. Can you begin to imagine how unfair that is to Bambers prospects of ever having received a fair trial?

    You mention that you would like to receive credible information from an unbiased source which I take it to mean you are not interested in my views on the matter because you see me as being in some way biased in favor of Bambers innocence? I understand your position, but do you really believe and think that I would be campaigning for someone who was responsible for committing, what to me, and everyone else, is such a revolting series of crimes, where a person has been alleged to have killed the foster parents who raised him, and his adoptive sister, and her two beautiful young children, if I did not think that there was something terribly wrong with the evidence that was used, and relied upon, to secure such convictions?

    The fact that I once served a prison sentence appears to in someway weaken the very points I have been trying to raise on Bambers behalf.

    If I thought that Bamber was guilty, why would I be trying to promote the idea that he was innocent? There would be no purpose in doing that. I actually promote the idea that Bamber is innocent because I truly believe that he could not have killed his sister in the main bedroom and stage managed her body to make it look like she committed suicide, even if he had wanted to. And the reason why I choose to believe that is because of the existence of the police message log content which confirm that the police who forced their way into whf, found two dead bodies in the kitchen when they first got in there, one dead male and one dead female.

    In such circumstances, why should it matter that I have served a prison sentence?

    If I make a statement that 3 + 3 = 6, does this mean that you must not believe or accept what I am saying just because I have served a prison sentence? Let me tell you something, when I first met Bamber in 1989, and he told me about his case, I took the view that the verdict of the jury was true and accurate. I spoke to Bamber and told him that I could not understand why two members of the jury could not find it within themselves not to convict him. At that stage, I could not understand or accept that two members of the jury could arrive at any other conclusion that he must be guilty because to put it rather bluntly, how could Sheila have killed herself in the main bedroom with the silencer fitted to the end of the rifles barrel, and how could she have removed the silencer after she was already dead, and how could she have taken the silencer all the way downstairs and hidden it in the gun cupboard and then walked all the way back upstairs to lay down dared again on the bedroom floor, with the rifle on top of her body, and her hands arranged around, and upon the gun?

    As I say I was originally in favor if Bambers guilt and the verdict of the jury being correct and justified, but I do not think that now, after discovering over the past 18 - 19 years, that vital information and evidence was deliberately and is continuing to be deliberately withheld from Bamber, his legal team and the court which tried him, and the courts which can quash these convictions..

    I am now 100% in favor of Bambers convictions being quashed, because he did not receive a fair trial in 1986 and he continues not to receive a fair crack of the whip by Essex police and the CPS continuing to withhold over 3 million documents under pii rules. Some of these 3 million undisclosed documents are the material which formed part of the original investigation by Essex police, in the original file SC/688, 85, which was collated and gathered to prove that Sheila killed the others and then herself.

    All of this material should have been disclosed to Bamber and his legal team as a matter of course and it should not have been concealed or swept under the carpet.

    True justice can never be served whilst ever people reject what anyone has to say if the person who says it has been convicted of a criminal offense or they have spent time in custody serving a prison sentence. This is the very reason why so many miscarriages of justice occur and or may be occurring.

    As I say I will shortly be posting the contents of the Dr's report, but this report which did not come into existence until the early 1990's is nothing compared to all the material and evidence which Essex police concealed from Bamber and his legal team and the court which tried him back in 1986.

    Ask yourself this question:-

    If you were arrested on some bogus charge and you later found out that the prosecuting authorities had deliberately withheld over 3 million pieces of information would you accept that you had received a fair trial?

    Be honest with yourself, both you and I know that you would be a very unhappy bunny rabbit..
    Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-07-2008 at 10:53 AM.


  • #127

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Initial findings of Herbert Leon MacDonnell and his two American Associates..

    Dr Herbert Leon MacDonell, (New York) wrote a report, dated, 26th October 1992, addressed to Mr Nick Robinson, London, W1Y 7LD:-

    Dear Mr Robinson:

    "I am enclosing an interim report on the Bamber case. I regret that I can not spend more time on this case at the present. I did not expect so many photographs and, as a result, I have spent much more time,in addition to several hours of two associates, than I would have for most cases. At this point the agreed upon initial review has more than been accomplished. Please send the second payment of $500.00 at your earliest convenience.

    As I have indicated in the report, there is no question as to the manner of death of Sheila Caffell. She did not commit suicide but, like the other four victims, was shot to death by someone else.

    From what I have seen thus far, I have not found any compelling evidence to suggest that these five murders were committed by any particular person. The circumstances which led to the arrest and conviction of Jeremy Bamber have not been totally evaluated if it is possible to do so from the material I have.

    I am sure you will be disappointed with my findings, however, the physical evidence I have discussed appears obvious".

    Respectfully Submitted

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell.


  • #128

    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    6

    biog

    Apologies if behind here but are there any recommended books about the subject or sites-other than the obvious?


  • #129

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by ladygarden View Post
    Apologies if behind here but are there any recommended books about the subject or sites-other than the obvious?
    ----------------

    ladygarden:-

    Roger Wilkes published a book on the case, entitled "Blood Relations", and a new hardback was due to be released by Scott Lomax entitled "Jeremy Bamber, Evil almost beyond belief". I will try and find out the ISBN numbers and post them for you, and I think a couple of other books have been published on the case, again, I will try to get the details for you..

    Mike Tesko.


  • #130

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Tesko View Post
    Dr Herbert Leon MacDonell, (New York) wrote a report, dated, 26th October 1992, addressed to Mr Nick Robinson, London, W1Y 7LD:-

    Dear Mr Robinson:

    As I have indicated in the report, there is no question as to the manner of death of Sheila Caffell. She did not commit suicide but, like the other four victims, was shot to death by someone else.

    Respectfully Submitted

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell.
    --------------------------------------
    Addendum:-

    At the time this report was commissioned in 1992, it was still not yet known about the existence of the police message log contents which tell of a different account about where the five bodies of the victims were found once the firearms team forced their way into the farmhouse. Everyone, including Bamber, his legal team, the CPS, the jury which tried Bamber and the media in general, all believed that once the police had gained entry into the premises that they only found one dead body downstairs in the kitchen and four other bodies upstairs in the bedrooms. Included amongst these, was Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell, who as we have seen concluded that "there is no question as to the manner of death of Sheila Caffell. She did not commit suicide but, like the other four victims, was shot to death by someone else".

    Based upon the beliefs which Essex police instilled in everyones mind that they only found one dead body downstairs in the kitchen when they forced entry into the premises, and the other four bodies upstairs in the bedrooms, the good DR's findings look rather ominous..

    However, once the contents of the police message logs became available in 2003, some 11 years later, MacDonells findings lead one to the inevitable conclusion that if Sheila Caffell was shot and killed by someone else in the main bedroom, that it could not have been Jeremy Bamber who had killed her there, and it could not have been Jeremy bamber who stage managed her body to make it look like she had committed suicide by use of the family owned (Anshuzt) rifle, since, Sheila's body had originally been found in the kitchen along with the body of her father (Ralph Bamber) as confirmed by the entries timed at 7:37am "the body of one dead male and the body of one dead female found in the kitchen", 7:38am "One dead Male, One dead female", 7:42am, "contact the police surgeon and the coroners officer regarding two dead bodies" all three of these messages were passed from within the house before the firearms team had completed its search of the downstairs at the scene and had not yet proceeded upstairs, and so we can be absolutely sure that two bodies and not one body, was found downstairs from as early as 7:37am and as late as 7:42am.

    Next:-

    An additional message timed at 8:10am, confirms that "after a thorough search of the premises, a further three bodies have been found upstairs, the building is now safe a secure for senior officers to enter". Note the reference to a further three bodies being found upstairs by that stage, and that along with the two other bodies already found downstairs, makes a total of five dead bodies?

    According to the contents of the police message log, a fourth body was never found upstairs at all, between the point when the firearms officers first set foot in the building at just after 7:30am and 8:10am, when three bodies had been found upstairs.

    If Professor MacDonnel had had access to the contents of the withheld police message log, would he have still concluded that Sheila was shot and killed like the other four victims, by someone else? That is the million dollar question? And if he did, would he have concluded as I do, that the only people that could have killed her by that stage, would have been the firearms team who were inside the house, at a time when Sheila's body had already been discovered downstairs in the kitchen at 7:37am, and presumed to be dead?

    Who killed Sheila Caffell?

    In these circumstances, it could not possibly have been Jeremy Bamber,who killed her, no matter how much anyone may dislike him, or suspect that he may have had something to do with it, because going by and on the contents of the withheld police message logs, Sheila was not dead when the firearms team stumbled upon her body in the kitchen at 7:37am, they just presumed that she was dead. If she was presumed to be dead in the kitchen by 7:37am, and then she regained consciousness, and had fled upstairs and afterwards she had died in the main bedroom from a solitary shot under the chin, then Bamber could not be held accountable for shooting her at that time (Between 8:10am and 8:30am that morning) because Jeremy was outside and in the company of a large number of police officers along Pages Lane, some 200 to 300 yards from the scene when Sheila died.

    According to Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell, "As I have indicated in the report, there is no question as to the manner of death of Sheila Caffell. She did not commit suicide but, like the other four victims, was shot to death by someone else".

    That someone else, could only have been a police officer, in light of what we now know.
    Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-09-2008 at 03:28 PM.


  • #131

    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    6

    Thankyou-

    MT-much appreciated


  • #132

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    131
    Does anyone know if Bamber has any more chances at appealing?? Last i heard, he was told that he would spend the rest of his life in prison
    I'm selling hundreds of true crime books- and i won't rip you off anyone interested??


  • #133

    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    6

    Books for sale

    Jules-give us a clue what you have-i have a number myself but i can't bring myself to throw/give them away!


  • #134

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by ladygarden View Post
    Jules-give us a clue what you have-i have a number myself but i can't bring myself to throw/give them away!
    What , my books?? It would take me forever to list them , but they are all true crime, serial killers, spree killers, nurses who killed, books by fbi profilers. women on death row, as well as over 100 true crime magazines
    Hope this helps
    I'm selling hundreds of true crime books- and i won't rip you off anyone interested??


  • #135

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    131
    I didn't really want to get rid of mine, but the weight of the book cases upstairs is causing cracks in the dining room ceiling lol
    I'm selling hundreds of true crime books- and i won't rip you off anyone interested??


  • #136

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    SCOTLAND
    Posts
    112
    http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/j...r_v_bamber.htm

    This link has to be the best i've seen yet, in that, it looks at the case from every angle, as we have been attempting to do, it's a lengthy read, but worth it!
    It Works For Me


  • #137

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell's Interim Report - 23rd October 1992...

    Re:- R. V Bamber (90 - 35)


    Interim Forensic Report

    I have completed a preliminary study of the photographs and reports that were sent to this laboratory relative to the above cited case. It must be emphasized that this report does not address all evidence, reports and photographs which have been made available. It has been issued simply to advise you of the findings thus far. The main evidence addressed in this report is bloodstain patterns that were photographed at the crime scene and a rifle found in a closet having a sound moderator.

    Main Bedroom - Mrs June Bamber:

    1. The bodies of June Bamber and Sheila Caffell were both found in the main bedroom. I have not seen a report on the blood groups of the small bloodstains that are present on the carpet extending from the right side of the bed (from the foot), down around the foot of the bed, up the left side to the general area of Sheila Caffell's body, and back to where Mrs Bamber was found, near the doorway. Photographs, 26. 30, 31 and 34 show these bloodstains very well.

    2. Mrs Bamber was shot while in bed. Bullets went through her neck and the pillow upon which she had been lying. The pillow perforations may be seen in photographs 45. Blood on the top of the pillow is from direct contact with a source of blood, not blood that was dripped or transferred and is consistent with Mrs Bamber lying on the pillow for a few moments after she had been shot. She then got up and moved around the bed to the other side dripping and / or expirated blood. That trail of blood began at the lower right corner of her pillow and ended at her body as described above.

    3. Mrs Bamber sat on the edge of her bed for a short while before she stood up. This would explain blood in that location shown in photographs 39 and 44. These stains are transfer patterns, produced from direct contact with Mrs June Bamber and not drip or projected blood patterns.

    4. Blood next to and under the body of Sheila Caffell was deposited prior to her falling on the carpet in that area. Photograph 31 shows her legs, nightgown, and arms are void of any small bloodstains similar to those on the carpet surrounding her body. This blood is very likely from Mrs June Bamber when she moved about the bedroom after being shot. It could not have come from Mrs Caffell.

    To Be continued ....

    The Main Bedroom - Sheila Caffell:-


  • #138

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell was not aware of police Mesaage Log contents - Two bodies downstairs..

    As can be seen from the contents of Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnells report into this case, he was not aware that police message logs existed in 1992, which place two dead bodies downstairs in the kitchen, namely, one dead male and one dead female (7:37am, 7:38am and 7:42 refers) when the firearms team first entered the kitchen..

    Bamber and his legal team did not know in 1992, that such police message logs existed because Essex police failed to disclose them to him or to his legal team or to the court which tried this case in October 1986..

    The fact that two different and seemingly conflicting accounts about where the five bodies were found once the police first got into the premises, is evidence which should not have been withheld and concealed from Bamber, his legal team and the court which tried him. Such information should also not be deliberately withheld from experts, such as Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell..

    Similarly, such material should not be withheld from the CPS, the court of appeal or the house of lords or Parliament, by Essex police..

    The fact that one version of events as told by Essex police has two dead bodies downstairs and three bodies upstairs, and yet another version by the same force has only one body downstairs and four bodies upstairs, is information which is capable of helping everyone to understand exactly what did take place after the firearms team forced its way into the premises at just after 7:30am, on 7th August 1985.


  • #139

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell Report concludes thast Sheila's body was moved after she was shot..

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell's report concludes that Sheila Caffells body was moved after she was shot and killed, and that the disturbance of her body indicates that she was murdered, rather than she had committed suicide..

    But who killed her?

    Jeremy Bamber - No
    Mathew MacDonald - No
    A member of the firearms team - Yes.


  • #140

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    SCOTLAND
    Posts
    112
    So, the scenario changes yet again! You're now saying a policeman shot Sheila Caffell dead? Let me see, this would mean that he caught Sheila in the act of killing the rest of the family? which would leave them with no other option, since she would be yeilding a gun? and then they cover it up? and what's more, they were such bad shots, they put two bullets in her?
    It Works For Me


  • #141

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
    So, the scenario changes yet again! You're now saying a policeman shot Sheila Caffell dead? Let me see, this would mean that he caught Sheila in the act of killing the rest of the family? which would leave them with no other option, since she would be yeilding a gun? and then they cover it up? and what's more, they were such bad shots, they put two bullets in her?
    Didn't Jeremy Bamber confess to his then gf that he had killed them all ???
    I'm selling hundreds of true crime books- and i won't rip you off anyone interested??


  • #142

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Bell View Post
    Yes according to her he did. Which, along with the cousins' suspicions, was one of the main reasons why the police turned their attention to Bamber.
    Did those cousins end up inheriting everything?
    I'm selling hundreds of true crime books- and i won't rip you off anyone interested??


  • #143

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
    So, the scenario changes yet again! You're now saying a policeman shot Sheila Caffell dead? Let me see, this would mean that he caught Sheila in the act of killing the rest of the family? which would leave them with no other option, since she would be yeilding a gun? and then they cover it up? and what's more, they were such bad shots, they put two bullets in her?
    --------------
    Bluefox:-

    You are taking my comments out of context with the way I portrayed the withholding of the police message log contents by Essex police which confirms that they found two bodies downstairs and only three bodies upstairs and the findings of Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell, who concludes that Sheila Caffell was shot and killed by someone in the same way that the other four victims were shot and killed. Based upon these two features, and the fact that the firearms officers did find a female body downstairs in the kitchen from 7:37am, onwards, then obviously the only female it could have been inside the kitchen was Sheila because as the good Doctor (MacDonnell) has pointed out, June Bamber was shot in bed and moved about a little inside the main bedroom but that she did not get beyond the entrance to the main bedroom door, and so we can be absolutely sure that the only female who could have been found downstiars in the kitchen area in keeping with the contents of the withheld police message log contents at 7:37am, was the body of Sheila Caffell.

    The point I was trying to make was that if the contents of the withheld police message logs are accurate and true, and we accept the findings of the good doctor that Sheila did not commit suicide but that she was shot and killed like the others, then obviously the only person or persons who could have been responsible for killing her in the main bedroom were the firearm's officers who were inside the building at that time.

    In this scenario, Sheila could only have been shot and killed by the police inside the house, because they originally found her body in the kitchen but her body ended up dead in the main bedroom upstairs - you work it out for yourself and you will not be able to come to another conclusion, other than the police must have been responsible for Sheila Caffells death in the main bedroom.

    Do not overlook what the good doctor has said about Sheila not committing suicide and that she was shot by someone else and that the killer stage managed Sheila's body after she was dead to try and make out a case for suicide.

    Please do not overlook the fact that it was never part of Jeremy Bambers case that Sheila committed suicide, he was led to believe by the original Essex police investigation that his sister had committed suicide after she had killed the others. It was the police who promoted that idea in the first instance. This being so, it must follow in light of all the now known circumstances that if anyone killed Sheila and stage managed her body in the main bedroom, that it could only have been the police inside the house who were responsible for doing that and those things..

    You appear to have a habit of trying to ridicule things I have been saying without first of all trying to get an explanation from me about why I have been saying these things, from time to time?


  • #144

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Herbert Leon MacDonnells Report, continued - 23rd October 1992..

    Re:- R. V Bamber (90 - 35)

    Main Bedroom - Sheila Caffell

    5. Blood running from Sheila's nose traveled across her face horizontally. No blood ran down towards her body. Therefore she could not have been standing or sitting up when she was shot and remained in such a position or some blood trails would have formed down her face and body. Directionality of the blood trails across her face are shown in photograph 28 and 29.

    6. Sheila Caffells right arm was moved after she was shot. Her right hand could have been holding her neck after she had been shot. Photograph 28 suggests that something or someone had smeared blood around the upper entrance wound in her neck. If her right thumb or fingers pressed against this wound they would have become bloodstained. Unfortunately, none of the scene photographs show her right hand in a perspective that shows blood in this location if it was there. A photograph of her right hand taken at the morgue does not show any blood inside the right hand but it is not known when this photograph was taken; before or after the biody was washed?

    7. While her hand was near her neck, or against it, blood ran down from her neck wounds and soaked into the upper right front of her nightgown. This blood also stained the inner aspects of her right arm between her wrist and elbow as may be seen in photograph 29.

    8. When her arm was positioned to where it was later found, blood from her fingers, or whoever was moving her arm, wiped against her nightgown producing the bloody finger marks that are shown in photograph 29. The large quantity of blood that had pooled between her right arm and upper body was released when her arm was moved. This blood ran down over the lateral aspects of her right arm as shown in photographs 27 and 29.

    9. Further evidence of the movement of Sheila Caffell's right arm is evidenced by the alternate stain and void elongated fold patterns in her nightgown. These stains shown just above her bicep in photograph 29, resulted when blood that had pooled up between her arm and folds in her nightgown was held in that location by compression.

    10. It is evident in photograph 29 that the letter or note that is either in or under the blue bible is not in the position it was in against the victims arm when it became bloodstained. When blood ran down Sheila Caffell's upper right arm, the bottom of the blood trail; shown to the left in photograph 29, produced a small stain on the edge of the letter or note, just over the letter "t" in "another." The bottom of this blood trail is not aligned with the stain on the note in photograph 29 so there has been a shift of the bible, the arm, or both.

    11. The blood on the carpet around the body of Sheila Caffell, was on the bible before the bible was placed on the floor. This is evident in photograoph 32.

    12. The rifle found over Sheila Caffell's body was placed in the position in which it was found. It has been reported that a rifle, found in another room in the house, had blood of the same group as Sheila Caffell in its sound moderator. The length of this rifle, from the end of the sound moderator to the trigger, is some thirty six inches. This distance is too great for Sheila Caffell to have self-inflicted her two neck wounds. Therefore, Sheila Caffell did not shoot herself. Like the other four victims, Sheila Caffell was murdered.

    Many additional photographs have been studied and conclusions have been formed regarding their significance. In particular, photographs of the kitchen where Mr Ralph Bamber was found have been studied, reviewed and certain conclusions on what he was doing when he was shot have been formed. Since these facts do not reflect on the overall question as to whether or not someone other than Sheila Caffell committed the murders circumstances of her fathers death seam relatively unimportant.

    Since I have concluded that the death of Sheila Caffell was not a suicide this should be sufficient for you to decide whether or not you may want me to submit my additional reports.

    Unfortunately, I cannot duplicate the photographs to which I have made reference in this report because of an agreement. Possibly, permission may be obtained to do this at some later date if proper application is made.

    Respectively submitted

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell, Director
    Laboratory of Forensic Science.


  • #145

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Conspiracy Theory versus the now known (2008) facts..

    Conspiracy theory versus the now known (2008) facts

    There are some who will not entertain any suggestion that there was a conspiracy involving a small group of Essex police officers, to cover up for what really took place once the firearms officers set foot inside white house farm, on the morning of 7th August 1985, no matter how much information or evidence is placed before them. According to these people, the police would not do anything to jeopardize any future proceedings that might have been brought against an innocent party. The police do not lie, they do not falsify records and they are not in the habit of deliberately misleading the Coroners court, and the judiciary and the juries which try these innocent victims for crimes they could not have committed.

    Jeremy Bamber is one of such victims.

    Essex police did not switch information and evidence which they had gathered under the file reference SC/688/85 to prove that Sheila had killed the other victims and then herself, by editing parts of it and destroying or concealing other parts of it, and by transferring all the information which would not help Jeremy Bambers case into a newly created file under a different reference SC/786/85 - Essex police would not do such a thing.

    Neither would Essex police create a separate photographic file inside which were placed all the damning pictures taken at the scene by PC Bird whilst the police inside the house were stage managing the victims body to try and make it look like she had committed suicide. The police would not do such things..

    But these are just some of things which Essex police did do in this case, and which they are responsible for doing in this case..

    There is and never will be any physical evidence, either on a scientific, or forensic basis which can point to his guilt, and the reason for this is that he did not have any involvement in the five deaths of his family members. The prosecutions case was based upon and around the use of misinformation and speculation, at best there was some circumstantial evidence which served to muddy the waters which was given by the relatives, some police officers and Bambers former girlfriend, Julie Mugford. The relatives and the police lied about how the silencer came to be in police possession with blood that was or could have been mistakenly attributed to the silencer as a result of its use in the shooting of Sheila Caffell. To say that the silencer evidence is and was dodgy would be an understatement.

    To also say that the court of appeal has looked at all aspects of the case and that these have all been rightly rejected, is also not true. Again, there exists so much speculation about what has been disclosed at the material time and what the courts have accepted and rejected as being true or false, leaves a lot to be desired.

    This man, Jeremy Bamber, deserved to receive a fair trial,back in October 1986, but he did not receive one.

    Instead, he became the victim of a witch hunt by his relatives and former girlfriend and one or two police officers who simply did not have a clue about what really took place inside whf at just after 7:30am on the morning 7th August 1985.

    Let us look at the facts which the prosecutions case was based upon and around at that time.

    It was their case that once the firearms team entered the house, they found one body, the body of Ralph Bamber in the kitchen. It took the firearms officers some 20 - 30 minutes to search all the rooms downstairs at the scene before they could even contemplate going upstairs to search all of the other rooms up there. It was not until just after 8am, that the firearms officers eventually managed to get upstairs and at that time, they discovered the body of Mrs June Bamber which was slumped in the doorway to the main bedroom. In the same room on the bedroom carpet alongside the bed, was the body of Sheila Caffell which had the family owned rifle on top of her body. The bodies of two children were found shot in their beds in an adjoining bedroom. This was how the prosecution described its case to the jury which tried Bamber for these five murders.

    They contended that Bamber had killed everyone, including his sister Sheila Caffell, and that once he had killed her in the main bedroom that he had proceeded to stage manage her body on the bedroom floor by the side of the bed to try and make it appear or to look like she had in fact committed suicide.

    The prosecution called evidence from various experts to support their claim that the overall length of the rifle with the silencer attached to the end of its barrel would have been too long to allow Sheila an opportunity to kill herself even if she had wanted to. A ballistic expert (Malcolm Fletcher) has testified to the effect that the only way the blood could have got inside the silencer where it was later discovered was if it had been attached to the rifles barrel at the time Sheila was shot and killed by a bullet that was fired under her chin. How had the silencer managed to find its way downstiars into the gun cupboard all by itself if Sheila had taken her own life? Dead persons cannot unscrew silencers and walk all the way downstiars and hide a silencer in a gun cupboard and them walk all the way back upstairs to lay down dead again on the bed room carpet next to the bed.

    These rather misleading and inaccurate statements fooled the jury into convicting Bamber for the murders.

    I have good reason for saying that these parts of the prosecutions case were misleading and inaccurate. To begin with, the claim that the overall length of the ansuzt rifle with a silencer attached to the end of its barrel would have prevented Sheila or anyone else from using the weapon so configured to take their own life, is not factual. Tests and experiments carried out at Birdwell Armory (2003) involving a replica rifle and silencer and a model name Amy Holland who played the role of the victim, demonstrated that there were several different postures which Sheila could have adopted with such a weapon and she could have shot herself. The experiments in 2003, were filmed and photographic records exist which confirm that the prosecutions case back in 1986, was badly handled and that the jury may have been misled about that matter. For anyone who is interested, I can supply the photographs taken at the time of the 2003 experiments to anybody who might seek to make the rather bizarre and ridiculous suggestion that it would have been impossible for Sheila to have shot herself in line with the prosecutions original claim back in 1986. What I will say, however, is that although evidence now exists to prove that that part of the prosecutions case was false and misleading, I do not personally think that a silencer was used on the gun which fired the fatal shot which killed Sheila Caffell.
    Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-13-2008 at 06:40 AM.


  • #146

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Conspiracy Theory versus the now known (2008) facts..

    Conspiracy theory versus the now known (2008) facts Continued..


    The new photographic material now in Bambers possession is capable of proving that Sheila or anyone else could have used the rifle with a silencer fitted to the end of its barrel to kill themselves with and that it was not too long as was portrayed by the prosecuting authorities, back in 1986. The photographic material (2003) which is now available, is more than capable of destroying that part of the prosecutions case.

    Fact of the matter, Essex police deliberately withheld the contents of the police message logs from the scene which places two dead bodies in the kitchen, one of these bodies was described as a dead female and this reference can only refer to Sheila Caffell, since, as we have heard, June Bamber was shot in bed, and died before she could leave the bedroom according to the report of Herbert Leon MacDonnell. Now MacDonnell, also says that Sheila Caffell did not commit suicide but that she was shot and killed like the others and that whoever killed her in the main bedroom stage managed her body by moving her right arm, and a bible and that the rifle was placed on top of her body afterwards to make the suggestion that it was a suicide.

    If Sheila was shot and killed by someone in the main bedroom and the person or persons who killed her moved her right hand and the bible and they placed the rifle onto her body after she had been killed as contended by the good doctor, then it is not part of a conspiracy theory to suggest that the only person or persons who could have been responsible for doing this to Sheila Caffell, were the police who were inside the house. It would be a simple case of the power of deduction, where there was a female body found in the kitchen presumed by the firearms officers to be dead in the kitchen at 7:37am, 7:38am, and 7:42am, which later ended up dead in the main bedroom upstairs by 8:30am.

    How did the female body from the kitchen (7:37am) end up in the bedroom upstairs by 8:30am?

    This confirms that there was a female still very much alive inside whf at the time the firearms officers first entered the building at just after 7:30am and that the female in the bedroom (Sheila) had not died until after 8:10am that morning. A police message timed at 8:10am, confirms that at this time a through search of the premises had been completed and that a further three bodies had been found upstairs and that the premises were now safe a secure for senior officers to enter the premises. Lets cut to the chase and be realistic, it is now known that at 8:10am, two bodies had already been found in the kitchen and that three other bodies were found upstairs in the bedrooms, which makes five bodies in total.

    By this stage there was never a fourth body upstairs.

    The fourth body (the female) found its way upstairs after 8:10am..

    The fourth body died upstairs in the main bedroom at some time after 8:10am..

    When the female fled from the kitchen at around 8:10 am, it left only one body downstairs in the kitchen , and that was the body of Ralph Bamber.

    This is the proper explanation for how a scenario of two bodies downstairs and three bodies upstairs by 8:10am, turned into a scenario of one body downstairs and four other bodies upstairs by 8:30am, the same morning. At least, this is the argument which Bambers legal team would have sought to rely upon at Bambers 1986 trial had Essex police not deliberately withheld the contents of the police message logs and Dr Herbert Leon MacDonnells report had been commissioned years earlier.

    Herbert Leon MacDonnell concludes that Sheila did not commit suicide but that she was shot and killed like the other four victims. In light of what is now known about where the bodies of the five victims were found by the police upon entry into the premises, it can only lead to one inevitable conclusion, call it a conspiracy theory if you like or whatever, but the fact of the matter is that Sheila was not dead inside the house by 8:10am, that morning, and her body was not even in the main bedroom by that stage. She died after 8:10am and prior to 8:30am, and by that stage she was upstairs in the main bedroom. If anyone shot her and moved her right arm and the bible and if anyone placed the rifle onto her body as contented by the Herebert Leon MacDonnell report, then it could only have been the police, no-one else.

    These are the unmistakable, unshakable facts surrounding this case.

    Essex police are responsible for covering up part of the police operation which went pear shaped inside the farmhouse which led to deadly serious consequences for Sheila herself.
    Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-13-2008 at 06:49 AM.


  • #147

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    There was a conspiracy to cover up the true circumstances surrounding the death of Sheila Caffell.

    There are some amongst us, who refuse to see the wood for the trees.

    It seems not to mater one jot that Essex police have succeeded in pulling the wool over everyones eyes, over the question of exactly how and in what circumstances Sheila Caffell died inside white house farm. She could not have died in two different places inside the farmhouse and have been found dead in both places, unless at one of those such places she was merely presumed to be dead and she had at some later point regained consciousness and fled to that other place where she eventually died.

    Sheila was presumed dead in the kitchen at 7:27am, onwards and her body remained in the kitchen at the scene until just after 8:10am, at which point her body became displaced upstairs to the main bedroom. By 8:30am, that same morning, Sheila Caffell was dead in the main bedroom - the firearms officers had been inside the farmhouse for about an hour by that stage.

    None of the firearms officers or any of the senior officers who were present at the scene, and who went inside the house at the material time, and who discovered the five bodies (upstairs and Downstairs) attended Jeremy Bambers trial in 1986, to testify how all the bodies had been found, and in view of the recent disclosure of the police message log contents which were in existence at the time Bamber went to trial but which had been deliberately withheld from him and his legal team and the court which tried him, which details a different account of the locations inside the premises where the police found the bodies, it must follow that the prosecution failed to identify exactly where the five bodies had been found to allow the safety of these conviction to remain in tact a moment longer.

    The court was entitled to know where the five bodies had been found by the police when they first got into the premises.

    Now, if two different versions existed as to where the five bodies of the five victims had been found, this is material or information or evidence which the court needs to hear about and they needed to hear about it from the very officers who first went into the premises at just after 7:30am, that morning..

    The court would have been very interested to hear why two different versions existed in the first place?

    (a) two dead bodies found in the kitchen and three other dead bodies upstairs by 8:10am

    (b) one body downstairs and four other bodies upstairs.

    Essex police not only concealed the contents of the police message logs, but they kept the very officers who found the bodies inside the house away from court and they made sure that none of them were able to testify and become exposed to cross examination on the very issues which were being concealed from Jeremy Bamber, his legal team and the jury.

    There was a conspiracy to cover up the exact circumstances of how Sheila Caffell died in the main bedroom between 8:10 and 8:30am, that morning..

    Jeremy Bamber does not have to prove why Essex police tried to cover up the way the police operation inside whf went dramatically wrong, only t5hat Essex police deliberately withheld evidence which could have proven his innocence. The fact that Sheila's body was originally found downstairs in the kitchen by 7:37am, goes a long way to establishing that Jeremy Bamber could not have killed his sister by shooting her dead with the family owned rifle, whether or not a silencer was attached to the barrel of that gun at the material time, and he could not have stage managed her body in the main bedroom to make it look like she had committed suicide, because the police originally found her body in the kitchen and they mistakenly presumed at that time that she was in fact, dead.

    Why couldn't Essex police see the fundamental clues which Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnel saw once he had an opportunity to view the crime scene photographs, that Sheila did not commit suicide but rather that she was shot and killed like the other four victims, and that someone, moved Sheila's right hand, and the bible and that after she was shot and killed the person or persons who were responsible for killing her, placed a rifle on top of her body?

    If, as the good doctor concludes, that Sheila did not commit suicide but was shot and killed like the other four victims and afterwards her body was stage managed to promote the idea that she had taken her own life, why did it readily fool Essex police into accepting that she had taken her own life?

    Who killed Sheila Caffell?

    It is 100% certain that Jeremy Bamber did not kill his sister (Sheila Caffell) in the main bedroom at whf, because the police originally found her body in the kitchen and they wrongly assumed that she was dead at that stage.

    These are the facts which are now known and these are the facts which the court of appeal has not yet rejected..


  • #148

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Commander of Firearms Team tells COLP Investigation that Body of Sheila Caffell was moved ...

    There were two parts to the police operation inside white house farm:-

    (a) Part one - between 7:30am and 8:10am, under the command of Police Sergeant Adams

    (b) Part Two - from 8:10am, onwards, under the command of Police Inspector Montgomery.

    For some reason, command of the operation changed hands midway through the operation inside the house and this coincided with the entry into the premises at 8:10am, of senior police officers after it had been declared that the premises were thoroughly searched and two bodies had been found in the kitchen downstairs and a further three bodies had been found upstairs. The two senior police officers who entered the house at this time, were Police inspector Montgomery and Detective Chief Inspector Harris. It was these two senior officers who alerted the other firearms officers inside the premises that the female body which had originally been found in the kitchen and presumed dead, was no longer there.

    Once inside the kitchen at whf, Montgomery and Harris soon realized that the operation had gone dramatically wrong and DCI Harris used the kitchen telephone to make contact with ACC Peter Simpson to inform him of the developments at the scene.

    DCI Harris talked to ACC Simpson for almost 15 minutes giving him a running commentary about the progress being made by officers inside the premises at that time (between 8:15am and 8:30am) and he only terminated the call once Sheila was shot and killed in the main bedroom upstairs at about 8:30am. These are the facts which are now known (2008) and these are the facts which Essex police still continue to make any comment about, despite it being some 23 years since it all unfolded inside whf back in August 1985.

    PS Adams, told the COLP investigation (1992) that he visited the scene in the main bedroom at about 9:00am, and at that stage, Sheila's body was further away from the edge of the bed and the bible was in another part of the bedroom on the carpet placed some 18 inches or so away from Sheila Caffells waist. He also told COLP that at the time he saw Sheila's body in the bedroom there was no weapon upon it. He left the scene soon afterwards and then along came PC Bird to photograph the scene from 10 O'clock, onwards, by which stage Sheila's body was positioned much closer to the bed and a rifle had suddenly appeared on top of her body with the victims right hand positioned on top of the rifles butt. The movement of Sgheila Caffells body as referred to by Dr Herbert Leon MacDonnell, and the placement of the rifle on top iof it after Sheila had been killed and all the other stuff he mentions and refers to in his report, are consistent with what PS Adams told the COLP investigation and the inevitable truth is that it was the police inside the house at the scene who were responsible for stage managing the body of Sheila Caffell and it was they who placed the rifle on top of her body, and it was the police who moved her right arm and the bible before PC Bird took his crime scene photographs..

    If Herbert Leon MacDonnells conclusions are true and correct, then Jeremy Bamber did not stage manage his sisters body in the main bedroom to try and make it appear like she had committed suicide, it was the police inside the house who were and are responsible for doing those things..

    Why did the police stage manage Sheila Caffells body to make it appear as though she had committed suicide, if she had not?

    How come the police at the scene ignored all the basic fundamental clues which Professor Herbert Leon MacDonnell has pointed out which clearly point to the fact that Sheila Caffell was murdered and why did Essex police appear to be so readily in agreement that she had taken her own life, when it was obvious that she may not have done so?

    Why conceal the police message log contents which pinpoints where the five bodies were originally found inside the premises?

    Why is it that not one police officer who entered the house at the material time, testified at Bambers trial to confirm where each of the five dead bodies had been found upon entry and expose themselves to cross examination?

    Why is so much information and evidence still being withheld from Bamber, his legal team and the courts which will decide Bambers fate on appeal? Millions of documents are still being withheld some 23 years after the event under pii rules.

    How can Bamber have received a fair trial and how can his convictions be deemed to be safe after considering all of these circumstances?

    It is now known that the police inside the house moved and disturbed Sheila caffells body and that it was the police at the scene who placed the rifle on to her body and it was the police who moved the victims right hand and it was the police who moved the bible so that it was resting slightly upon her upper and outer right arm which they had also moved when stage managing the crime scene before PC Bird took his crucial photographs at the scene..

    The photographs taken by PC Bird only record the position of Sheila Caffells body at the time he took the crucial pictures inside the main bedroom (at 10 O'clock) not what the scene was like when the police first entered it at just after 7:30am, earlier that morning..

    The jury were deliberately misled into accepting that the crime scene photographs depicted how the five bodies had been found when the firearms team first got into the premises at just after 7:30am that morning, but it is now known that this claim was false and totally inaccurate.


  • #149

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Sheila Caffell was shot only Once?

    Police Inspecdtor "Bob" Miller, entered the house soon after the firearms operation inside it had concluded. He in fact, was responsible for showing Dr Craig, the police surgeon, around the premises with a view to getting him to verify death in each of the five cases.

    It is somewhat bizzare, that in both of their witness statements, Miller and Craig, only refer to Sheila as having been shot once, not twice like she had been.

    At the opening of the inquest, 14th August 1985, PI Miller had told the Deputy Cornoer, Mr Thompkin, that Sheila had shot the other four victims and then she had killed herself by a solitary shot to the throat.

    Why is it, that the police surgeon who was present at the scene and police inspector Miller who was one of the first non firearm members to enter the scene, should both refer to Sheila as only having been shot once, and not twice, like she had been?

    Why did Miller mislead the Deputy Coroner, Mr Thompkin, about the very same issue and feature?

    As aresult of recieiving this information from PI Miller, the Deputy Coroner, Mr Thompkin, authorisesd the release of the five bodies for disposal by way of crenmation in the case of the three adult victims, and burial in the case of the two child victims.

    But would the release of the bodies have been authorised had Miller told the Deputy Coroner the truth about Sheila having been shot twice, not once?


  • #150

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Sheila was not shot twice inside the main bedroom, only once..

    Police Inspctor "Bob" Miler was one of the first officers who was not a firearms officer, to enter the opremises after the firearms operation inside the building had been terminated. There was a good reason why he should only be wanting to refer to Sheila only having one wound to her throat instead of two different ones..

    Dr Craig, was also confided in and he was persuaded only to refer to one wound upon thje victims throat, as opposed to the two which were clearly there.

    The reason why Miller and Craig only mentioned one wound upon Sheila caffells throat, was because she had only been shot once in the region of the main bedroom, she had in fact been shot once, elsewhere inside the house, namely, once in the region of the kitchen, downstairs, where the firearms team had originally found her body, which they had mistakenly assumed was a dead body..

    At just after 9 O'clock that morning the vast majority of the firearms officers, with the exception of Police Inspector Montgomery and PS Woodcock had all left the scene, and the only officers who were their inside the house before SOC arrived were the two aforementioned firearms officers and other senior police officers who included DCI "Taff" Jones, DCI Harris, DCI Gibbons, PI Miller etc..

    These were the officers who would dictate how the police had found the bodies once they had got into the house and these were the officers who would by way of authority from ACC Peter Simpson, pretend that the first part of the police operation inside the house which had gone dramatically wrong at just after 8:10am, had not and did not take place or occur.

    SOC arrived at the scene at about 9:20am, but they were not allowed inside the premises until the senior officers and the two firearms officers re-arranged Sheila Caffells body (asisted by DI Cook, SOC) and stage managed it ito try and make it look like she had been found dead in the main bedroom. The other SOC officers, PC Bird, DC Hammerslery anmd DS Davidson, did not get allowed inside the house until 10 O'clock and by that stage all the moving of the body of Sheila and the stage managing had taken place.

    PC Birds crime scene phoptographs record exactly how the police inside the house had re-arranged Sheila's body before he had been allowed inside the premises, to start taking his pictures.

    These photographs would later be used by the prosecution to persuade the jury that the bodies of the five victyims had been found as shown in the crime scene photographs that were being made availabkle to them. The court album only had 50 preselected pictures contained inside it, from over 281 which had been taken.

    Essex police still have not disclosed all of the pictures which were taken that day at the scene des[pite some 23 years having elapsed since PC Bird took those pictures.

    Essex police have good reason for not wanting to disclose such material..

    Because they stage managed Sheila Caffells body and they covered up part of the police operation which went dramatically wrong inside the house that morning..


  • #151

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Essex police systematically destroy evidence at the scene ..

    There has never been another case quite like the Bamber case..

    Not only was a shadow case file created (SC/786/85) into which the original evidence was edited or disposed of altogether, and some of the most crucial crime scene photographs were not carried over into it, but the police destroyed bloodstained exhibits at the scene by burning it all on a huge bonfire in the grounds of white house farm during the first three days of the investigation. In this respect, between 7th and 9th August 1985, and the occasion when Essex police handed the keys to whf back to Ann Eaton, they burned and destroyed crucial bloodstained carpets, bed linen and clothing that was recovered from every room in the building.

    For some reason, Essex police did not want any of this material to survive the incident because it would enable others who followed behind to reconstruct exactly what had taken place inside the farm house that morning. The best way to prevent anyone being able to reconstruct what took place was for the police who were involved in this cover up, to destroy the evidence which was capable of helping others who might come along to investigate the incident from discovering the truth..

    Burn all the bloodstained evidence from the scene - that is what appeared to be high on Essex police's agenda at the scene..

    Essex police did not even bother to collect up and make safe all of the other weapons and ammunitions which were strewn about all over the place in different rooms, they just left it all there where it had been found, and the relatives took possession of it all once the police gave them the keys to the building on 9th August 1985..

    The reason why Essex police went to all these lengths at such an early stage of the investigation is because they had something to hide..

    They were eager to put the blame for the murders of four of the victims upon Sheila Caffell, and they were as keen as mustard to put forward the theory that Sheila had taken her own life. Later they would allege that it was Bamber who made them believe that Sheila had killed the others and then herself, but such a suggestion is nothing but poppycock. How could Bamber have possibly influenced what the police discovered inside the premises and how could he hope to ensure that the police would misinterpret all the fundamental clues that support the case for Sheila's body having been moved and stage managed after she was already dead?

    The reason why the police at the scene interpreted Sheila's death as a suicide was because it was in their best interests to portray it as one in all the circumstances of the case. Jeremy Bamber did not make them cover up that part of the operation inside the house where two bodies had originally been found downstairs in the kitchen as confirmed by the contents of the police message log. The police dug themselves a large hole into which they fell and they did everything they could to try and climb back out of it.

    Destroying bloodstained evidence at the scene on a huge bonfire in the grounds of white house farm was part of that cover up..


  • #152

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Bamber convicted of four murders without Prosecution producing any evidence that he was guilty of

    Jeremy Bamber was convicted of the murdrs of Ralph Bamber, June Bamber, Daniel Caaffell and Nicholas Caffell, without the prosecution having to produce any evidence that Bamber had killed any of them - instead they relied upon the evidence that Sheila could not have killed herself in the main bedroom at white house farm to be sufficient to prove that he also killed the others, in addition to Sheila Caffell, herself.

    Technically speaking, there could be an argument that the convictions for four of the five murders should be quashed for the reasons given.

    If successful, Bambers life tarif where the Home secretary, and a recent High Court decision, ruled that life must mean life in cases where someone has been convictred of killing two of more persons, will no longer apply to his case.

    Fact of the matter is, that a person cannot be convicted of a murder unless the prosecuting authotities call evidence in the presence of the jury to support such a suggestion, and because absolutely no evidence was called or adduced to the effect the Bamber killed Ralph, June, Daniel and or Nicholas, the jury should not have been asked to return a verdict of guilty in those four cases, since, there was no evidence to support such a suggestion.

    You cannot convict Bamber of four of the murders just because the prosecution proved to the jury that he killed one of the victims (Sheila Caffell), each allegation has to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt and because the prosecution based theuir entire case around the argument that Sheila could not have killed herself in the main bedroom and that bamber had killed her etc, this does not constitute proof that he killed any or all of the other four victuims.


  • #153

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Cover up at scene involved stage managing of kitchen and the body of Ralph Bamber..

    The cover up which Essex police instigated at white house farm, which was carried out to try and cover up for the way the police operation inside the building had gone dramatically wrong at about 8:10am, that morning, included for the fact that the police inside the house, acting under the authority of ACC Peter Simpson, and other senior police officers at the scene, who include DCI Harris, DCI Gibbons, DCI "Taff" Jones, PI Miller, PI Montgomery and DI Cook, involved the stage managing of the scene in the general vicinity of the kitchen and the body of Ralph Bamber, the details of which can now be reported upon.

    The police moved Ralphs body from the original position it was found in, i.e. it was sat upon a wooden chair directly behing an internal door that the police had to pass through to get into the kitchen. As a result of this, the police pushed the door open gradually and forced Ralph Bambers corpse to fall to the kitchen floor where it ended up in a heap by the corner of the aga stove.
    His body was frozen by rigor mortis in a sitting position and the police repositioned his body so that it did not cause an obstruction to the officers should they require an immediate escape route from the kitchen if they were challenged by anyone with a gun. In this respoect, they placed Ralphs bloodstained head, directly into the coal bucket, and they placed a pair of cotton trousers and a towel directly over pooled blood which had started to gather on the kitchen floor where Ralph's body had been toppled over to.

    The crime scene photographs which SOC PC Bird took at 10 O'clock that morning, showing Ralphs body by the corner of the aga with his head in the coal bucket, is exactly how the police had displaced it, as previously described.


  • #154

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Police lied about moving things and bodies around at the scene

    Esex police have been accused of moving things around at the scene and in particular, moving two or more of the bodies, before SOC PC Bird, took his photographs at the scene from 10 O'clock, onwards. They deny doing anything of the sort.

    They have a huge problem in that photographs taken by PC BIrd in the region of the kitchen, show a large wooden chair pushed directly up against the very same internal door through which the six members of the firearms team had originally had to pass through to get into the kitchen, at just after 7:30am. Additionally, PC Birds crime scene photographs show the kitchen table standing upright upon its four legs with crockery and utensils and three spent cartridge cases diosplaced upon its worktop - despite one member of the raid team describing how the kitchen table had been overturned with broken crockery and untensils strewn about the floor as though there had been a terrible struggle of sorts..

    If Essex police had not moved or touched anything at the scene before SOC PC Bird started to take his pictures in the kitchen, at about 10 O'clock, how had the chair got behind the door, and how had the kitchen table uprighted itself and the crockery and utensils leapt back onto the top of the table and how fortunate for the three spent cartridge cases to jump onto the top of the kitchen table, as well. Also, how had the cotton trousers so conveniently fell over pooled blood along with the use of a towel over blood next to the coal bucket where Ralphs head had been deposited?

    Who had a reason for preventing the spread of pooled blood further afield on the kitchen floor?

    Of course, the answer was the police inside the house are and were guilty of doing these things, not the supposed killer, since, this would surely have alreerted the police at the scene that Sheila could not possibly have killed the others and then herself and be responsible for trying to prevent the spread of pooled blood around the kitchen floor by placing a pair of cotton trousers and a towel over it?

    I am sorry, I do not think so, thank you very much..

    Essex police are liars..

    They did move things and they did move bodies and their own photogrphs prove that this is what they have done and been repsonsible for.

    Surprise, surprise, Essex police only supplied 50 preselected and hand picked photographs in a court album, that became known as the court album, for the jury to look at, they deliberately kept 231 other pictures away from the jury and it is not suprising why they chose to do that, because if all the photographs had been dsiiclosed it would have been possible to reconstruct in greast detail exactly how the police had stage managed the scenes inside the kitchen, and the main bedroom, as part of their cover up.

    I have got positiive proof in my possession that Essex police have told lie after lie about not nmoving things before SOC PC Bird took his crime scene photographs. Fact of the matter is, Essex police have lied and they continue to lie about what they were and are responsible for doing. They are working on the basis that if they do not admit to anything that no-one will be able to do anything about it. They rely on the CPS withholding over 3 million documents under pii rules, some of which is capable of exposing exactly what this prosecution is all about.

    It is 100% positive that the police stage manwged the bodies of Ralph and Sheila.

    It should be noted that not oine member of the raidf team who first entered the house at just after 7:30am, that morning has come forward to say that Sheila's body was not found downastruars in the kitchen and that the police operation inside the house had run smoothly and without a hitch - this is because they dare not make any public statement saying so, because they now are aware that evidence has been disclosed and is avavailbale which is capable of proving what took place and why there was a cover up..
    Last edited by Mike Tesko; 09-18-2008 at 03:28 PM.


  • #155

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    What Constitutes a lie?

    The reader is invited to consider what constitutes a lie regarduing members of the raid team who forced their way into white hiouse farm at just after 7:30am, on the morning of 7th August 1985, who state that the kitchen tabkle was overtuirned and there was broken crockery and utensils strewn about all over the kitchen floor as thoyugh there had been an almighty struggle inside the kitchen, and that no-one moved or touched anything, including furniture or bodies before SOC PC Bird took his crime scene photograohs from 10 O#clock, onwards..

    Now either, the kitchen table was overturned and there was broken crockery and utensils strewn about all over the kitchen floor, or as the case may be, there was not, but there could not be a situation whereby the kitchen table was overturned and it was not overturned and that broken crockery and utensils were strewn about all over the kitchen floor and not strewn about all over the kitchen floor, at one and the same time.

    Why is it that essex p-olice say one thing and yet the photograohic material which they took themselves proves conclusively that what they have said is false and totally inaccurate.

    So, why did Essex police upright the kitchen table and why did they proceed to place table mats, crockery that was not broken and utensils back on top of the table they had uprighted before PC Bird took his pictures? How did the three spent cartirdge cases end up on the top of the kitchen table in time for SOC PC Bird to photograph them there by 10 O'clock?

    In which part of the kitchen were these three spenty cartridge cases oriionally found in?#

    Who took the decision to move them onto the top of the uprighted kitchen table?

    How can anybody trust or believe what Essex police have been saying about what took place once its officers arrived at the scene and forced entry into it? They say they did not touch oir move anything prior to PC Bird taking his pictures, but they are liars..

    They alterded the scene in the kitchen and by this I mean they displaced Ralph bambers body from its oprigional seating position behind the internal kitchen door through which they had to pass to get into the kitchen in the first instance..

    If the police had to displace the body of Ralph Bamber from its sitting position beghinjd the internal door, to enable them to get into the kitchen, why didn't Essex police just simply say that this is what they had to do to enable them to get into the kitchen, and to allow them to perform their duties? Instead, they make false statements which cannot possibly be true.

    I cannot accept that the killer used a pair of cotyton triousers and a towel to try and prevent the pooled areas of blood from spreading further afield on the kitchen floor? This action was obviously done by the police who must have originally thought about trying to preserve the original crime scene before someone in high office took the decision to cover up that part of the police operastion inside the house which had gone dramatically wrong..

    How did Ralph Bambers wrist watch end up underneath the carpet in the kitchen?

    It seems almost certain that it got there because the police stage managed the scene and the watch accidentally got left underneath the carpet upon which the police uprighted the previously overturned kitchen table..

    photograpic evidence exists to back up all of the claims I am making..

    The kitchen was stage managed and the body of Ralph bambner was also stage managed and tghis was done by the police inside the house, and was not necessarily known about by other police officers at the scene who were conducting duties outside the premises.

    Thiose who went into the house, certainly knew the truth about what took place and why it was felt necessary to touch and move things around..


  • #156

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Julie Mugford the Liar..

    When questioned by Bambers legal team at his 1986 trial, Julie Mugford, Bambers former girlfriend ,denied that she had struck a deal with the News of the World newspaper, for £25,000 for her exclusive story should Jeremy Bamber be convicted of the five murders.

    However, in 1992, when Mugford was interviewed by the COLP investigators, she admitted that both she and her mother had been put up in a five star hotel, all expenses paid for by the News of the World, and after Bamber was convicted for the murders, she was paid £25,000 for her exclusive story, in keeping withy what was alleged by Bambers legal team at the time of the trial.

    Julie Mugford is therefore, appears to be a compulsive liar and nothing she has ever said about Jeremy's proposed involvement in the murders can be believed. She appears to let her mouth say anything. It is dangerous to accept anything she has ever had to say on the matter.

    In his summing up speech, the trial judge, Mr Justice Drake, told the jury that they could not convict Jeremy for the murders based purely upon what Juile Mugford was saying.


  • #157

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Julie Mugford tried to suffocate Jeremy Bamber..

    A few weeks before Jeremy Bamber dumped his girlfriend, Julie Mugford, she had tried to suffocate him with a pillow by placing it over his head when she found out that Bamber had been talking to another woman on the telephone, and that he had made arrangements to meet her. Afterwards, when Bamber asked Mugford why she had done it, she replied that if she could not have him all to herself, then she would make sure that no-one else could..

    After Bamber dumped Mugford, she went to the police after being encouraged to do so by her friend, and during 31 interviews she perfected evidence that was used to support his prosecution.


  • #158

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    A really Bizarre coincidence..

    Robert Woodwis Boutflour, went to see ACC Peter Simpson at Essex police DHQ on 6th September 1985, and it resulted in ACC Simpson authorising a new investigation into the murders. A new investigating team was appointed to look at the case a fresh from the beginning and this also resulted in a new crime reference file being created (SC/786/85) into which was placed edited material from the original file (SC/688/85) and new information designed to show or to support Bambers involvement in the killings.

    How strange, that Julie Mugford should also choose to approach Essex police on that very same date (6th September 1985) to spill the beans on Bamber so to speak?

    Another rather strange feature of this case is that none of the relatives mention Juulie Mugfiord at all in any of their rantings about the murders or Jeremy's part in them, and Mugford makes no mention at all about any of the relatives in any of her statements to the police - it was as if the relatives and Julie Mugford did not know that the other party existed at all..

    From my point of view, I find it hard to accept that Robert Boutflour should go to see ACC Peter Simpson on 6th September 1985 and persuade him to instigfate a fresh investigation and that Julie Mugford should choose to come forward with information linking Bamber to the murders on that very same date?

    There must have been collusion between Mugford and the relatives..


  • #159

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    Mugford identifies bodies of victims and tries to communicate with Bambi..

    Julie Muigford volunteered to go to the hospital mortuary and identify the five bodies of the victims.

    Whilst there, she admits to trying to communicate with the spirit of Sheila caffell, because she says she wanted Sheila to tell her what had happened at the house?

    If Mugford knew what had happened, i.e. that Jeremy had killed everyone and that he had been planning to kill everyone, as she alleges, for over a year beforehand, why was Mugford trying to communicate with dead spirits to find out what really took place or happened.

    Mugford was the prosecutions star witness, but the sad truth of the matter is that she was doo-lally in the head, and someone who had a vindictuive streak in her nature and the suggestion which Bambers legal team levelled at her during the trial whuilstbeing cross examined "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned" fits the cirucmstances of her testimony perfectly..


  • #160

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    sheffield, England
    Posts
    137

    It is not true that Mugford went to the police voluntarily..

    The claim that Julie Mugford the former girlfriend of Jeremy Bamber had gone to speak to Essex police on 6th September 1985, voluntarily, is false. She was infact coerced to do so by her close friend who contacted DS Jones on her behalf. It was Julie Mugfords close friend who contacted the police and it was Julie Mugfords close friend who accompanied her to see the police. It was Mugfords friend who stayed in police accommodation with Mugford during her vist to see the police, and in all probability, it was Mugfords friend who put words into Julie Mugfords mouth..

    There exists a police action report which questions "why is Julie Mugfords first confession written in the third person"?

    The obvious answer was because she had the words put into her mouth by someone else, that someone else was her close friend who forced Julie Mugford to contact the police in the first instance..

    Bamber, his legal team and the court which tried Bamber for these murders did not know that Mugford was coerced to go to the police by her close friend and that this same close friend had put words into Juilie Mugfords mouth which formed her initial confession to the police on 6th September 1985. This ommission had it been known about at the time of the trial in 1986, would have had a dramatic impact upon Julie Mugfords testimony and the prosecutions case in general..